Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 1:14 am Extra Links: What's Fair?
I recently had an interchange with another emperor regarding the methods used by various dynasties and various members to exchange links inside, and outside, of dynasties.
As we all know, displaying 10 links all the time will really drain your credits. Unless you've recently won a million-credit contest or are rich enough to keep buying credits, this can't be maintained indefinitely. Members have tried various ways of parceling out their extra links for shorter periods of time. Unfortunately, this decision means that not all alliance members will be able to take advantage of those extra links, and there is a question of what's "fair".
Some of the current and former top dynasties seem to have perfected the art of exchanging links within the dynasty, giving themselves a much higher click ranking in the total, but depriving their allied dynasties of those same links and frequently resulting in a lopsided gained/given ratio. (It's no surprise some of these dynasties argue against using gained/given as a measure of dynasty quality!)
Other dynasties maintain the practice of consistently showing a smaller number of links all the time, or showing a larger number of links for a day rather than all the time. This makes them a better ally, but doesn't make them as competitive in the rankings.
I'm interested in everyone's opinion on which they think is better. Opinions of MMC Mob's allies are very important to me. So consider the following three methods of showing extra links:
Method 1: Open 9 extra links for 9 clicks at a time by request, 5 times per day. Total clicks given to alliance: 81 x 5 = 405 per day, or 2835 per week.
Key feature of method 1: some of the same members, usually within your own dynasty, click the same links each day, so this helps dynasty competitiveness.
Method 2: Open 9 extra links all day once a week. Assume 315 people click during that day: that makes 2835 extra links, one day per week.
Key difference from Method 1: it is guaranteed that every member of the alliance can get the extra links 1 time per week, but not every day.
Method 3: display 2 extra links all the time, 7 days a week and a third extra link all day 2 of those days. This also results in 2835 extra links per week, but spreads them out over two of those days.
Key difference from Method 2: spreads out the same links to everyone over the entire week. I personally favor this, as I actually care about getting clicks on 3 of my minicities, and have a dragcave link that I might want a day's worth of clicks on 2 times per week. Of course, using this method I'll never show all 10 links, and some other dynasties might measure my "quality" by showing those extra links.
So... opinions? Which method(s) do you prefer? Is Method 1 unfair, or totally fair for a dynasty to do in order to stay #1 (at the risk of alienating its allies)? Do you think Method 2 and Method 3 are substantially different? You may answer more than 1 choice.
Display your extra links, as many as you can afford, during any Happy Hour you are present for.
Since happy times are public, most people can take advantage of at least one of them...
(I will ignore things like "give this egg some extra clicks/uniques right now" because that's a different matter.)
[ Added: Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:15 am ]
Also note that different games work better with different click patterns. Mondozoo rewards you for the sum of your total clicks. Dragon Cave eggs get sick if they get too many clicks too soon. DragonAdopters dragons appear to do best with a steady diet of clicks every day; extras in the same day are wasted.
I realize that bringing the games into a discussion of the competition for click activity on Yarold's is a bit off-topic to some people
Also note that different games work better with different click patterns.
...
I realize that bringing the games into a discussion of the competition for click activity on Yarold's is a bit off-topic to some people
Heh. True enough, and obviously as a click exchange you should display links you want to get clicked at the times you want them clicked. No argument there. This thread is dealing mostly with the extra, invented minicities that people have created for the sole purpose of giving their dynasty (or allies) more clicks for the "competition".
1. What do you mean by 'the art of exchanging links within the dynasty?' Do you just mean Happy Hours? I can't think of anything else, but happy hours are widely advertised to everyone in the alliance, not just the dynasty..
2. I really think method 3 is the best for me (and other Valenth users). Plus, it is nice to click the links at any time throughout the day. I hope method 3 wins the vote
I am also an allie so I will also post something :p
I did not vote becuase I prefer it completely different, lets call it method 5 :p
9 Extra Links once a day at different times.
I put my 9 extral Links once at 08:30, once at 10:42, once at ..... you can put there whatever you want. I just try to spread the times so different membners of the alliance get them.
Yes, but what MUSHpark is saying is ways to improve your daily clicks. It's also for the members who are not present at exclusive happy hours (e.g. UBC's 20.00), and won't get the extra links. Like me, I miss a few happy hours because of school and sleep (Total a day that means I miss 3 and a half HH).
Well I am never online for UBC's 20:00 HH! But it is a well-advertised HH and meant for our entire alliance to share. Im 100% sure that our HH has always been advertised to all our allies and that it wasn't meant to deprive our allies of links while we click our own links. We wanted 1 HH per day to make things easier on everybody and a time was chosen which was convenient for the dynasty leaders, who have the right to choose the time because they are the ones who buy a ton of credits so that they can show all 10 links more often than anyone else in the dynasty. It's not a strategy to hoard clicks, which is how it was construed...but anyways, a vote for option 3 will solve all the problems
_________________ Don't Join Valenth; Ask Me Why!! DNA and KEVANA are Tyrants who Don't Follow Their Own Rules!
1. What do you mean by 'the art of exchanging links within the dynasty?'
I was referring specifically to RMV (prior to the recent changes) meeting in MSN or other chat rooms and displaying links with a limited number, sometimes on "History" where they would be less likely to be clicked by other ally members. They did it very well... achieved top clicks while keeping most of their links exchanged within their dynasty.
Kronia wrote:
I really think method 3 is the best for me (and other Valenth users). Plus, it is nice to click the links at any time throughout the day.
Yes, I agree that not timing extra links to particular times of the day is a good strategy, as it gives everyone a shot regardless of work/school schedule or which side of the world they love in. Options 2 and 3 both accomplish that.
jassej wrote:
And everybody knows the MMC UBC in 20:00 have Happy Hour
Yes, having a single HH for a dynasty is a very good thing. Recently with all the different happy hours out there, it is much harder to get HH links. But it is a dynasty's right to have their own HH and as long as links are up for at least a few minutes, to give everyone a fair shot, I think this is as "fair" as a HH can get.
You're right Jassej. It is not really a "problem" but it IS an area that could be improved a little bit and maybe make everyone a little happier! And without trying to go down the route that a certain dynasty has recently taken.
_________________ Don't Join Valenth; Ask Me Why!! DNA and KEVANA are Tyrants who Don't Follow Their Own Rules!
Based on feedback I have chosen to display 3 links most of the time instead of doing happy hours or links on request.
Other dynasties will get the same number of total clicks this way, and it is easier for me to do and all 3 of my links that I actually want to get clicks will get them instead of a lot of wasted clicks to useless minicities.
Method 1: Open 9 extra links for 9 clicks at a time by request, 5 times per day. Total clicks given to alliance: 81 x 5 = 405 per day, or 2835 per week.
Key feature of method 1: some of the same members, usually within your own dynasty, click the same links each day, so this helps dynasty competitiveness.
When I set limit to 9 clicks, the actual number of clicks will range 12-20, The limit set by members is not strictly enforced when the member has enough credits. This method can easily consume 4000+ credits/week. Requires 886 ave/day to maintain (4000/7+315) for 315 ally members. Or...917 ave/day for our dynasty 400 ally members, IMO not practical.
MUSHpark wrote:
Method 2: Open 9 extra links all day once a week. Assume 315 people click during that day: that makes 2835 extra links, one day per week.
Key difference from Method 1: it is guaranteed that every member of the alliance can get the extra links 1 time per week, but not every day.
This method is predictable that it will consume the 2835 credits. Requires 720 ave/day to maintain for 315 ally members.
Since my dynasty, MMC UBC, maintains ~400 ally members, the total credits consumed is closer to 3600 each day all 9 extra links are shown. With 400 ally members this method will require clicking ave of 914/day to maintain... IMO, not practical.
MUSHpark wrote:
Method 3: display 2 extra links all the time, 7 days a week and a third extra link all day 2 of those days. This also results in 2835 extra links per week, but spreads them out over two of those days.
I do not understand the math being implied, here is the computation from my understanding...
(2 extra links) * (315 ally members) * (7 days) +
(1 extra link) * (315 ally members) * (2 days) = 5040 extra credits consumed/week.
Again since limits are not specified, the amount of credits consumed is predictable, but requires a member to maintain 1035 clicks/day to maintain... (5040 extra / 7 days + 315 base link clicks).
My dynasty, with 400 ally members requires 1314 ave/day for a member to maintain. Again, IMO, not practical.
Bottom line... None of 3 presented methods are practical without being subsidized.
When I set limit to 9 clicks, the actual number of clicks will range 12-20,
And it may not be 5 times per day then. 4 times at 12 is 48 clicks per link, pretty close to the 5 times at 9 of 45. I fudged the numbers to make the math easy, recognizing that sometimes it's a little more and sometimes a little less.
PaiGow wrote:
Since my dynasty, MMC UBC, maintains ~400 ally members, the total credits consumed is closer to 3600 each day
Not quite true. We maintain about 400 ally members as well, but not all of them will click you each day (take a look at all the 0's or other low clicks in your total alliance). For example, at this very instant, my alliance total is 401. But if I go into history and count rows of people who have clicked me (remove duplicates, display -1 and limit) I get 336. So only 336 people have clicked me in the last 24 hours out of an alliance of 400. (That is the reason for our 350 minimum click limit, by the way, it is what is needed to stay positive, but I digress!)
So again, 315 is a slight fudge to make the math work out the same as my assumptions for method 1, but it's in the correct ballpark.
Your number might be higher than my 336 because you have different allies, but I am sure it is not 400.
Quote:
I do not understand the math being implied, here is the computation from my understanding...
(2 extra links) * (315 ally members) * (7 days) +
(1 extra link) * (315 ally members) * (2 days) = 5040 extra credits consumed/week.
Oops. I shouldn't have said "extra". I meant 2 links (total) * 5 days and 3 links (total) for the other 2 days.
I was particularly trying to compare it to another emperor's strategy of "9 extra links 1 day a week". I am just spreading those 9 in various ways (7 extra for the first link every day plus 2 extra on 2 of those days)
PaiGow wrote:
Again since limits are not specified, the amount of credits consumed is predictable, but requires a member to maintain 1035 clicks/day to maintain...
As I mentioned, that was a typo. I meant for a total of 315*9 (as 315*5 + 630*2) extra clicks, or the 720/day (extra, above what you are clicked) average cited for method 2.
Given 336 people clicking me per day I would need to click 1050 other links... I do about 600 of those on dynasty and then click main site and history to get a few other hundred... so this is about the rate of extra links that I can show.
I will venture to state that the method of preference to supply extra links for members to click depends on the goals of the dynasty....
1) Provide nearly constant clicks day-to-day to all members in dynasty. Where competition within the dynasty is not so much a factor and wanting 'quality' clicks to links that you truly care about, this might be your goal.
2) Provide potential for wild swings in day-to-day clicks to benefit die-hard clickers. With many contests in some dynasties (ours included) being maximum click based and the competition is fierce, this might be your goal.
I don't think there is a 'best' way to for all dynasties, except possibly to have a variety of dependable allies with dedicated members....
Cheers,
BTW:
2 weeks ago I put up 9 extra links 1 day from reset-to-reset with 400 limit each... got ~370 clicks each.
Daily I put up 9 links at 20:00 HH with 35 limit and it consumes ~450 credits (50 credits/link)
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